Coming Soon to HD DVD: Silicon Optix HD HQV
by Derek Wilson on February 8, 2007 1:25 AM EST- Posted in
- GPUs
HD HQV Performance
For these tests, we will be using a beta version of PowerDVD HD 6.5 along with hardware acceleration to play back the HD HQV HD DVD. This works much the same as it did with the standard definition HQV test which is a collection of clips playback from a DVD. The software DVD, HD DVD or Blu-ray player, with hardware acceleration enabled, will use the graphics hardware to offload the decode process from the CPU. The byproduct of this is that image quality is more influenced by the hardware being used than the software when using hardware acceleration.
For AMD we are using Catalyst 7.1, and for NVIDIA we look at 93.71 for the 7 series and 97.92 for the 8 series. Our results on both 7 and 8 series cards for NVIDIA are the same, so there will be no distinction between the two when talking about NVIDIA results. This comparison is as much between AVIVO and PowerDVD HD as it is of the hardware at this point. Both AMD and NVIDIA should have some headroom for improving performance through their drivers in the future.
The maximum score for HD HQV is 105 with 80 of those points having to do with proper deinterlacing of interlaced HD sources. All broadcast HD sources in the US today are interlaced, and there are many HD DVD movies provided in 1080i as well. Fewer Blu-ray titles are 1080i, but they aren't impossible to find. While our HD DVD version of HQV obviously tests HD DVD players, these features will be important for the playback of any interlaced HD source. Because of this, we really expected NVIDIA and AMD to perform well.
Unfortunately, reality did not live up to our expectations. We'll break it down by test. While we would love to provide screenshots, our version of PowerDVD doesn't support screenshots, and taking pictures of the TV just doesn't provide the detail we need. Descriptions of what's going on will have to do for now.
Noise Reduction
Both AMD and NVIDIA score a flat zero on this test. None of the AMD or NVIDIA cards we tested performed any noise reduction on either the flowers or the boat scene. There weren't any artifacts present, but it is very clear that neither camp performs any noise reduction on HD video at this point.
Video Resolution Loss
AMD averages fields and thus looses detail. The result is a gray color filling the corner blocks rather than alternating fine lines. NVIDIA doubles the scanlines in one field and eliminates half of the data, as the corner blocks are solid colors. This means that both solutions fail in different ways. PowerDVD's software performs similarly to AMD hardware, which means that currently available computer hardware and software will not faithfully reproduce interlaced video.
Jaggies
Once again, AMD and NVIDIA both fail to eliminate diagonal aliasing. This is another example of the poor deinterlacing provided by computer hardware and current drivers. Eliminating jaggies is a major way to improve the visual experience of watching interlaced video on a progressive display like a 720p or 1080p HDTV or a computer monitor.
Film Resolution Loss
Like the video resolution loss test, both NVIDIA and AMD fail this test. The failure was a result of the same problems we saw in the video resolution loss test, meaning that rather than performing inverse telecine, both AMD and NVIDIA treat 1080i created from a film source the same way they would treat video. For AMD this means averaging fields, and for NVIDIA this means eliminating half the fields.
Film Resolution Loss - Stadium Test
When playing on AMD hardware, flickering is apparent in the stadium. While NVIDIA hardware doesn't flicker, a moiré pattern is apparent in the stands. Both of these fail to pass the test and demonstrate different issues that can appear when film is poorly deinterlaced.
The overall result?
AMD: 0
NVIDIA: 0
For these tests, we will be using a beta version of PowerDVD HD 6.5 along with hardware acceleration to play back the HD HQV HD DVD. This works much the same as it did with the standard definition HQV test which is a collection of clips playback from a DVD. The software DVD, HD DVD or Blu-ray player, with hardware acceleration enabled, will use the graphics hardware to offload the decode process from the CPU. The byproduct of this is that image quality is more influenced by the hardware being used than the software when using hardware acceleration.
For AMD we are using Catalyst 7.1, and for NVIDIA we look at 93.71 for the 7 series and 97.92 for the 8 series. Our results on both 7 and 8 series cards for NVIDIA are the same, so there will be no distinction between the two when talking about NVIDIA results. This comparison is as much between AVIVO and PowerDVD HD as it is of the hardware at this point. Both AMD and NVIDIA should have some headroom for improving performance through their drivers in the future.
The maximum score for HD HQV is 105 with 80 of those points having to do with proper deinterlacing of interlaced HD sources. All broadcast HD sources in the US today are interlaced, and there are many HD DVD movies provided in 1080i as well. Fewer Blu-ray titles are 1080i, but they aren't impossible to find. While our HD DVD version of HQV obviously tests HD DVD players, these features will be important for the playback of any interlaced HD source. Because of this, we really expected NVIDIA and AMD to perform well.
Unfortunately, reality did not live up to our expectations. We'll break it down by test. While we would love to provide screenshots, our version of PowerDVD doesn't support screenshots, and taking pictures of the TV just doesn't provide the detail we need. Descriptions of what's going on will have to do for now.
Noise Reduction
Both AMD and NVIDIA score a flat zero on this test. None of the AMD or NVIDIA cards we tested performed any noise reduction on either the flowers or the boat scene. There weren't any artifacts present, but it is very clear that neither camp performs any noise reduction on HD video at this point.
Video Resolution Loss
AMD averages fields and thus looses detail. The result is a gray color filling the corner blocks rather than alternating fine lines. NVIDIA doubles the scanlines in one field and eliminates half of the data, as the corner blocks are solid colors. This means that both solutions fail in different ways. PowerDVD's software performs similarly to AMD hardware, which means that currently available computer hardware and software will not faithfully reproduce interlaced video.
Jaggies
Once again, AMD and NVIDIA both fail to eliminate diagonal aliasing. This is another example of the poor deinterlacing provided by computer hardware and current drivers. Eliminating jaggies is a major way to improve the visual experience of watching interlaced video on a progressive display like a 720p or 1080p HDTV or a computer monitor.
Film Resolution Loss
Like the video resolution loss test, both NVIDIA and AMD fail this test. The failure was a result of the same problems we saw in the video resolution loss test, meaning that rather than performing inverse telecine, both AMD and NVIDIA treat 1080i created from a film source the same way they would treat video. For AMD this means averaging fields, and for NVIDIA this means eliminating half the fields.
Film Resolution Loss - Stadium Test
When playing on AMD hardware, flickering is apparent in the stadium. While NVIDIA hardware doesn't flicker, a moiré pattern is apparent in the stands. Both of these fail to pass the test and demonstrate different issues that can appear when film is poorly deinterlaced.
The overall result?
AMD: 0
NVIDIA: 0
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JarredWalton - Thursday, February 8, 2007 - link
*grumble* Should be "we've done HQV...."ShizNet - Friday, February 9, 2007 - link
big part of GPU driver problems are backwards compatibility [GF2-7, Rad.7-X1, DX6-9..];DirectX is totally new beast - why not draw the line and develop drivers from now on for Legacy devices and DX10+ ones?
this will keep old and new drivers in 'good' shape and there's no need for over bloated size files with old junk.
Wwhat - Sunday, February 11, 2007 - link
Since DX10 is vista-only and vista uses a whole new drivermodel it is obvious and inevitable that there are separate drivers developed for post-DX10 heh.So why are you asking for something that everybody already knows is going on and sees happening? Have you not heard about the issues concerning vista and the issues the graphics companies have/had releasing drivers for it?
Plus since ATI-nay-AMD has lots of X1- cards only stuff, it's clear that they also separated their drivers in that sense already.
kilkennycat - Thursday, February 8, 2007 - link
I'm sure that Silicon Optix would only be too happy to quickly develop a hardware HDTV silicon-solution for nVidia and ATi/AMD or their board-partners as manufacturing-option for their graphics cards.. No doubt Silicon Optix developed the HD-HQV tests both to weed out the under-performers AND encourage the widest possible use of their silicon......... Would save nVidia and ATi the bother of even more driver-complication and possible tweaks to their GPU hardware (for mucho, mucho $$) for the few that want the highest-quality HD replication ( regardless of whether the source is 1080p or 1080i or even 720p) from their PCs... The same few would probably be only too willing to shell out the $50 extra or so for the "High-quality-HD" Option-version of their favorite video card.abhaxus - Thursday, February 8, 2007 - link
I use either VLC or DScalar to watch 1080i on my PC. I've got an X800XL so I don't have the ability to use avivo. Would be interested to see how this disc fairs on those two solutions, I've always liked VLC's X method deinterlacing.RamarC - Thursday, February 8, 2007 - link
The testing seemed to focus on de-interlacing issues. HD DVD (and Blu-Ray) are intended to store progressive (non-interlaced) content. Some early titles (and crappy transfers) may be stored as 1080i, but by the middle of this year, 95%+ off all HD titles will be 1080p and de-interlacing will be non-issue.ShizNet - Thursday, February 8, 2007 - link
why focus on interlaced content?______________________________________
can you say TV-broadcasting?
same 95%+ of 'stuff' you'll be watching is TV/Cable/Dish [which are 1080i] and not [HD]DVDs nor IPTV for next 5 years+
even when all TV stations will go digital it's only 540p, don't confuse it up w/ HDTV - 720/1080[i/p]. only BIG ones with deep pockets will go HDTV full time.
autoboy - Thursday, February 8, 2007 - link
You guys are missing the point of this test. Broadcast TV is almost all 1080i content and deinterlacing is very important. The HD-DVD is simply the source of the benchmark but should be able to test the playback capability of PCs for broadcast HD as well as interlaced HD-DVD if it exists. Playing progressive scan images is easy and the only thing that should affect it is the noise reduction which I don't use because it ussually reduces detail.Still...this article left me with more questions than answers.
What decoder did you use for the ATI and Nvidia Tests? Nvidia purevideo decoder or purevideo HD?
Did you turn on Cadence detection on the ATI and Inverse Telecine on the Nvidia card?
What video cards did you use? You ussually use a 7600GT and x1900pro
What drivers did you use?
What player did you use?
Is this test only for HD-DVD decoders or can you use any mpeg2 decoder which would make this a much more relevant test since 1080i HD-DVD is rare and Broadcast HD is what really matters here.
What codec does the HQV use? Mpeg2? VC-1? H.264? Because most VC-1 and H.264 are progressive scan anyway and Nvidia does not claim to support purevideo with anything but mpeg2.
Did you turn on Noise reduction in the Nividia control panel?
Why does Nvidia claim HD Spacial Temporal Deinterlacing, HD Inverse Telecine, HD Noise Redution, etc in thier documentation but cannot do any of the above in reality? Is this h.264 and not supported?
hubajube - Thursday, February 8, 2007 - link
Well this settles whether or not I build an HTPC for HD movie play. This combined with needing a fast CPU (read expensive) as well as a HDCP capable video card pretty much kills a HTPC in the short term. I'll just get a standalone player for now.cjb110 - Thursday, February 8, 2007 - link
Could you get more hddvd players and push them through this test?!?!Also include the DVD results too, as its no good if it can only do one format correctly.
tbh I think it is pretty atrocious that only recently with the Denon 5910 and the Oppo players that we have a dvd player that actual plays dvd's 'properly'.