NVIDIA GeForce GTS 250: A Rebadged 9800 GTX+
by Derek Wilson on March 3, 2009 3:00 AM EST- Posted in
- GPUs
More From CeBIT: New Mobile Parts
Unfortunately, we were unable to get any notebooks with these new GPUs to test them out before we tell you about them, but both NVIDIA and AMD are announcing new mobile GPUs today.
NVIDIA's move parallels what's happening on the desktop in that the newest additions to the mobile line up are 55nm G92 based parts with names in the new style NVIDIA has chosen. Actually, the entire lineup of 9xxxM series parts is being replaced by parts with new names. This is certainly more expected on the mobile side, as we usually do see much more lag in this space than on the desktop.
As for the specifics, the new parts are the top of the line models. The GTX 280M will be up to 50% faster than the 9800M GTX, which is nice in theory, but final performance will still be up to notebook makers who will set the final clocks on the part on a per notebook basis to accommodate their power budget. The GTX 260M is one step down from the 280M in that it has 112 SPs enabled (like the original G92 introduced as the 8800 GT) and lower maximum clock speeds.
These two high end GTX parts replace the top end 9800M parts, and subbing for the 9800M GS is the GTS 160M which will also offer improved performance, although we didn't get full specifications on this part. Rounding out the bottom of the lineup are the GT 130M and the G 110M.
On the AMD front, we see something a little more intriguing in the form of the first 40nm GPUs in the mobile space. Smaller die sizes, lower power and better power are promised, though the general naming will stay the same for AMD. The new 40nm 4800 series parts can be paired with either DDR3, GDDR3, or GDDR5; the choice is up to the notebook maker. AMD touts the fact that they can get about double the processing power in the same area with their new process, which will only benefit them going forward.
NVIDIA paints the GDDR5 option as overkill, but we really won't know about performance of either the new NVIDIA or AMD parts until we have hardware to test.
The NVIDIA and AMD supplied relative performance graphs are nearly useless in sorting out how these parts should compare to each other, so we'll really have to save the head to head for a time when we have hardware on our hands. 40nm could be a big plus for AMD, but remember that NVIDIA has made the first move in making mobile drivers available from their web site. The value of that is very high, as notebook OEMs tend not to like updating their drivers very often. Sure, it's possible to hack desktop drivers onto a mobile part, but it is a supreme headache and we hope AMD will soon follow in NVIDIA's footsteps with this move.
Back to the Tests at Hand
Now that we've covered all the announcements and introductory material, let's get to testing the hardware we've got in our hot little hands.
We got our card just a couple days ago, so we haven't had time to test everything, and we've only received one card so we haven't been able to test SLI with the 1GB version. We would also have added to our benchmarks by including 1280x1024 in our tests if we had had the time. This is a very important resolution for this class of hardware, but 1680x1050 should be a good enough indicator of relative performance in most cases so that this won't matter too much.
Our comparisons will be a little lop sided though. We've got two each (for single and dual configurations) of the 512MB 4850 and the 512MB GTS 250 (the 9800 GTX+). These comparisons we can do, and it's nice and neat as both parts are now set at a $130 (cutting recent street prices by about $15). We do have a GTS 250 1GB, but we don't have a 1GB 4850 to compare it to. On the flip side, since we've only got 1 GTS 250 1GB, we can't compare GTS 250 1GB SLI to the 4850 X2 2GB we have.
The test setup hasn't changed for this article, except that we've had to use the 182.08 for the GTS 250 1GB.
| Test Setup | |
| CPU | Intel Core i7-965 3.2GHz |
| Motherboard | ASUS Rampage II Extreme X58 |
| Video Cards | Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 4850 X2 2GB ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB CrossFire ATI Radeon HD 4850 CrossFire ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB ATI Radeon HD 4850 NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260 SLI NVIDIA GeForce 9800 GTX+ SLI NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260 core 216 NVIDIA GeForce GTS 250 1GB NVIDIA GeForce 9800 GTX+ |
| Video Drivers | Catalyst 8.12 hotfix ForceWare 181.22 |
| Hard Drive | Intel X25-M 80GB SSD |
| RAM | 6 x 1GB DDR3-1066 7-7-7-20 |
| Operating System | Windows Vista Ultimate 64-bit SP1 |
| PSU | PC Power & Cooling Turbo Cool 1200W |
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Wurmer - Tuesday, March 3, 2009 - link
Performances aside, Nvidia should get their naming scheme straight. All this renaming and name swapping only contributes to get the customers confused. Now matter how it's explained, make this simple. Higher number, more powerful card ! In this regard, I find that ATI has made an effort of late.I'll also agree with one of the above poster that Nvidia was taken aback by the release of the 4870 and 4850. ATI hit the nail right on the head and the green team seems to have a bit hard time devising a proper response. Instead of getting their pray in their gun sight they use a shotgun and pepper the target all around......
SiliconDoc - Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - link
Shotguns usually KILL with just one shot - and ATI has caused another charge off, another BILLION dollar loss for AMD.I'm not sure NVidia hit them, (they obviously don't need to) so let's hope they don't, as well.
I'm also not sure what it means when people keep speculating that ATI "caught them off guard" - it doesn't really mean anything - it's just a stupid way of saying "ATI did better than I expected" ( but it's "cool" to not say that and put down NVidia instead, huh... since so many around the geek spots "taught you to say it that way" ).
Then after "being caught off guard" NVidia "drops a card" and it's because "they panicked" - right ?
DEREK - explained it - didn't he.... " NVida released the 9800GTX... "on the eve of the 4850 launch"....
YES, THAT'S HOW OFF GUARD THEY WERE.... NVIDIA HUH...
They released a DAY BEFORE ati did....
And they're STILL USING the 9800 - to battle the 4850 that was relased AFTER Nvidia....released their card.
Oh well....
DEREK tried to make nvidia sound evil, too - for releasing "on the eve of " the sainted red card 4850 release day - those nasty nvidia people spoiling the launch by releasing on ati's "eve"...
By golly, it's no wonder Obama was elected my friend.
Mr Perfect - Tuesday, March 3, 2009 - link
Hey, uhm, in that link posted on page two, there is mention that the press review cards are specially picked by Nvidia. Any idea if this is true?SiliconDoc - Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - link
Doesn't matter when they are stock clocked. The reviewers can do all sorts of things to "compensate" for how they want outcomes, anyway, like editing ini files and choosing the games and the order - heck even using a card that isn't the card they are supposedly reviewing.spinportal - Tuesday, March 3, 2009 - link
The GTX250 1GB is barely useful over it's 512MB counterpart except for power usage and slot size. The est. street price of 149 is already countered by the AMD4870 512MB and tests shows it's a hair better. Given the 250 uses less juice over the 4870, it's odd that the 250SLI is using more juice than the 260 core 216 SLI, so there goes that benefit.NVidia cannot strip down the GT200 core to reduce the power load from 2 6-pin to just 1 for 150W. Perhaps there is something to be said for GDDR5 power reduction.
Either way, the 250 is a win for nvidia in the mainstream budget for less power usage, CUDA, & Physx at the same price of the 4870 512MB which runs hotter, noisier (probably) and less feature rich. Does DX 10.1 matter at this point? PureVideo 2 is a wash vs. AMD's UVD.
It's distateful rebadging a GT92b in the GT200 naming scheme. This helps NVidia's costs by EOL the whole 8800GT architecture.
But by April, who's going to care? New spins are comings. This stop gap is only to reduce bleeding. Hopefully next gen is executed better so performance grows as power demands decrease.
kx5500 - Thursday, March 5, 2009 - link
Shut the *beep* up f aggot, before you get your face bashed in and cut
to ribbons, and your throat slit.
SiliconDoc - Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - link
Take your finger off the key, you're repeating, you dummy.Wolfpup - Tuesday, March 3, 2009 - link
I'm none to crazy about the random GPU/CPU naming this industry has always seen, but I disagree with Nvidia somehow needing a budget version of the 260/280 GPUs.I mean the 8800 series is basically the same thing. Sure there are some improvements here and there, but basically the 260 is the same thing, but with massively more execution hardware. I don't really see this huge distinction between buying a 250/9800GTX+ and it not being a stripped down 260...I mean it would almost be the same thing anyway.
And if nothing else, it's great to see how much less this 250 uses in terms of power. I mean this is still a really nice GPU that I'd be glad to have in a system. (I'm on a laptop with a 9650GT, which is yet another 32 processor part...and even this isn't half bad at all!)
SiliconDoc - Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - link
The red fanboys need Nvidia to cut the arms and legs off the GT200 and turn it into a puny 4830 (that has the top core ati has made, can make).The PROBLEM for red fanboy red freaks is just that... their great and sainted ATI has their "superwhomper super efficient super technology core! Oh Goddd! it's so greaaattt ! (*red boy orgasm)" - in the lowly 4830 - now compare that to the GTX260/192 and THAT'S where the red fanboys stands (or, really cries, rather).
Now look at the 4830 top ATI core and compare it to the GTX285... oh that's PAINFUL.
Now do the reverse...
Compare the top core 4870 to the top Nvidia core GTX260/192 (lowest itteration) - and golly, it EVEN BEATS the 4870 sometimes...
So THERE you have "the big ugly problem" for the red fanboys - who keep wailing that Nvidia MUST make a lower GT200 part for them...
( their tiny inner red child needs some comfort - it's just not fair with that big evil green GT200 SPANKING the rv770 so badly ! It's "abuse" ! )
Can we have a GT200 core that is as LOUSY at the 4830 ?!?! please please pretty please!!! we have some really hurting little red fanboy crybaby whining fud propaganda doper diaper babies that need some satisfaction and their little red egos massaged...
DON'T make them face the truth, EVER , nvidia, you big mean greedy green ...
( Yes, dude, they keep begging for it, and THAT'S WHY ! )
There is no doubt about it.
LuxZg - Tuesday, March 3, 2009 - link
How about making an article where you'd test all those G92 renames, rebrands, overclocks and shrinks?So put a fight between 8800GT 256MB (137$), 8800GT 512MB (154$), 8800GTS (171$), 9800GT 512MB (148$), 9800GT 1GB (171$), 9800GTX (205$), 9800GTX+ (214$), 9800GTX 1GB (228$), GTX250 512MB (+230$ ??), GTX250 1GB (+240$ ??). And if I've missed some variation, please include that too :)
Than test them all overclocked with their default cooling.
I just want to see how much have they gone from the first revision till these last ones. Prices in brackets are for local prices in Croatia where I live. And yes, you can buy them all.. I even found an 8800GTX 768MB card and 8800GTS 320MB as well, interesting, both at the same 171$ price that gets you "new" 8800GTS (512MB) or 9800GT 1GB :D
Now, since you can buy all these cards, and most of them are really close in price (some 100$ from all-new top to the rock-bottom 8800GT 256MB; if you exclude those than it's just some 60$ difference) - it would be an interesting article. Especially for those aiming at SLI for their old card which they've bought earlier.
And while here, I support the above comment - try SLI these 8800/9800 cards with these new GTX 250. Should have no problem, but to check the performance (gains) anyway..